for the innocence project. thank you for your time. >> thank you. >> eliot: have a great evening. we'll see you tomorrow. >> jennifer: i'm jennifer granholm. tonight in "the war room," listen up, candidate romney! he's talking about you! >> let me warn you and let me warn the nation... against this whole invasion that says of course we believe these things. we believe in social security. we believe in work for the unemployed. we believe in saving homes. we believe in all of these things. but we do not like the way the present administration is doing

them. we will do all of them. we will do more of them. we will do them better. and most important of all the doing of them will not cost anybody anything. [ applause ] >> jennifer: okay. first of all i admit last night was rough. even though i did predict here on this program that i thought the president would lose the first debate. i really, really didn't want it to happen! i was so hoping to be proven wrong. now, i admit it. progressives, you admit it, too. you were, before last night

feeling your oats, you might have been getting a little bit cocky. some of you might have been able to -- been calling the race, cenk uygur and then last night happened. it wasn't good. but people, this is not the time to lick our wounds or whimper or complain. we do not have time to lick our wounds. you know what? we've gotta bring our "a" game, too. no more complacency. we're in the last round of this fight! this is the final mile of the marathon. it's the ninth inning of this tense baseball game. the debate last night might have woken up the sleeping beast that is us progressives. so arise from your slumber folks! or as samuel l. jackson would say -- >> i strong will you suggest that you wake the [ bleep ] up. >> jennifer: all right. now that we're awake let's see

where we are. president was back in a fighting mood today. pointing out that romney's policies last night were very different from the rest of his campaign. i think what the president might have been wondering is that age-old question... >> obama: i repeat will the real mitt romney please stand up? >> jennifer: will he stand up? unfortunately, the real mitt romney has stood up and here's what he's saying. this is what mitt romney is saying. of course i believe in all of these things! medicare, work for the employed, tax cuts for the middle class. saving homes cross my heart and hope to die. i, mitt romney, believe in all of these things. but i do not like the way the present administration is doing them. so just turn them over to me and i will do all of them. i will do more of them.

i will do them better and the doing of them will not cost anybody anything. now, mitt romney would surely win the golden pinocchio. suffice it to say he told so many whoppers, too many to recount here. we're going to air our top mitt debate lies throughout tonight's show. let's start with the biggy. taxes. >> romney: first of all, i don't have a $5 trillion tax cut. my view is we ought to provide tax relief to people in the middle class. my number one principle is there will be no tax cut that adds to the deficit. >> jennifer: the tax cuts. remember how he said he would lower the rates on everybody by 20%? that's on his web site, part of his tax plan? that lowering of the rates costs $5 trillion. now, he says he wants to make

the tax cut revenue neutral. that's great. so how would he pay for that $5 trillion tax cut? he says he will close loopholes deductions although he will not say which ones. so what does that look like? in order to pay for such a huge tax cut $5 trillion, he's going to have to get rid of things like the mortgage interest deduction which helps middle class homeowners. in other words, he's going to have to raise taxes on the middle class. that's what cutting a deduction is. and that's exactly why his campaign refuses to specify which loopholes he would close. when talking points memo asked romney's spokeswoman andrea saul how much his tax cuts would cost she doubled down on the lie saying his tax reform proposal is revenue-neutral. >> jennifer: well, unless you're telling us how you're paying for it, you know the old saying, you tell a lie big enough and keep repeating it,

people are going to come to believe it. that's why it is up to us. not simply to lie down and accept the lies. do not become numb. arm yourself with the facts! we all have to do that. we all have to fight in these last days to the election. all right. so to hash over last night's presidential debate and look ahead to president obama's strategy in these days ahead we're going right now to chicago and ben labolt, the national press secretary for president obama's re-election. so ben welcome into "the war room" again. let's get right to it. what's the day after looking like for team obama tonight? >> well, you saw the president out there on the campaign trail today, calling out what were mitt romney's distortions last night. the president said that the same mitt romney didn't show up at the debate as showed up in the republican primaries. he was running away from his $5 trillion tax cut plan for millionaires and billionaires but we know the facts. the middle class and seniors

would have to pay for the tax cut. he talked about replacing the affordable care act but he didn't say with what. he said he would cover people with pre-existing conditions. what he left out is if you have a pre-existing condition and aren't covered right now or between jobs, you're not going to be covered under mitt romney. we'll spend the next several days making clear what positions mitt romney misled the american people on. >> jennifer: so there is an opportunity there sure for that because mitt romney and we're cataloging these lies here inside "the war room" tonight as well to let everybody know. but there was at least a sense from the great supporters of president obama, there was a sense of deflation. it was good to see that the president was out there swinging on the campaign trail today. do you have any data, any polling information that would give us some hope that maybe all was not lost? >> well, this has been a close and competitive race in key states for the past year and a half.

i don't think anything changed last night. look the pundits' scorecard is different from us. the pundits' scorecard is how many punches did the canada lates land against each other. i don't think the president viewed the debates as a steel cage match. his goal was to reach the undecided voter tuning into the campaign for the first time who wanted to hear about the economic choice in this election. he laid out we need to continue investing in areas like education and manufacturing and research and development. reduce the deficit in a responsible way and can't return to the same policies that crashed the economy and devastated the middle class in the first place. there's no doubt that from a performance art perspective governor romney was pretty good last night. james lipton should be pleased. but that wasn't the goal. he danced around his position on the issues and that's what you heard the president and vice president saying on the campaign trail. >> jennifer: just quickly one more question about last night then i do want to pivot forward

because the opportunity is, of course to move and get up off the mat. a lot of people have been asking was the strategy to go in and perhaps be less confrontational more sober so that mitt romney would be in an attack mode which might make him look either not presidential or not likable. was there strategy there? >> the american people know that mitt romney can ably attack the president. that's been the premise of his campaign for the last year and a half. he started out with his republican opponents mowing them down and telling them to stop whining and then attacking the president along the campaign trail for the past year and a half. mitt romney admitted that that wasn't an effective strategy when he selected paul ryan as his vice presidential candidate. he said that he knew it had come down to an economic choice. again, i don't think that undecided voters at home are sitting there scoring the number of punches that candidates land.

they wanted to hear clear credible plans. that's what the president was focused on and will outline the choice in the days ahead. >> jennifer: which is great to hear. in fact, there was some news from democracy corps who did some focus grouping and for our viewers, undecided voters and those who were loosely affiliated, nobody switched to go to romney. >> that's right. the cnn panel was split exactly. >> jennifer: exactly. let's listen to a sound byte from the president on the stump in denver today. >> obama: when i got on to the stage, i met this very spirited fellow who claimed to be mitt romney. [ laughter ] but it couldn't have been mitt romney because the real mitt romney has been running around the country for the last year

promising $5 trillion in tax cuts to pay for the wealthy. he didn't know anything about that. >> jennifer: all right. so i love this, of course. and it looks like -- you know, the president's running against a guy who changes his position as much as nicki minaj changes the color of her hair. i'm assuming we're going to see ads that pull apart the lies from the debate last night that were in fact, flips from where he had been before. >> that's absolutely right. in fact, we released one earlier today that will make sure to get to you. we talked about the fact he was playing hide and go seek with his tax plan last night. there were another few moments in which he committed to policies that would devastate the middle class. he made clear that he wasn't going to take action against tax breaks for companies that ship jobs overseas. in fact, we know that mitt romney's tax plan would

encourage 800,000 jobs to move offshore. and so mitt romney committed a whole series of policies last night. he made clear that in that republican primary debate where he said he pledged not to raise a dime in revenue from the wealthiest americans to reduce the deficit and he signed the norquist pledge that he stands behind that. those are very important moments last night that will be focused on. >> jennifer: totally agree with you on that. one last question, ben ole buddy, ole pal just between you and me, when we get to the town hall debate, the president going to be a little more pugilistic? >> well, i think if we tweak anything, you know, the president had to make a decision last night. his decision was to lay off the economic choice in his -- lay out the economic choice and his plans. i don't think anybody expected how dishonest mitt romney would be about his. so i certainly think that will ensure that anybody watching that debate understands exactly what mitt romney's plans are even if he's not willing to look

the autoworker in the eye and tell them he wanted to let detroit go bankrupt. >> jennifer: you preach it, ben! that's what i'm talking about. put up the dukes! all right. ben labolt, national press secretary for president obama's re-election campaign. thank you so much for joining us inside "the war room." coming up, we're going to get on the road to 270 electoral votes with the master of predictions "the new york times" nate silver. nate will walk us through his predictions on the race. how did the debate affect it? you won't want to miss it. plus we have more debate lies from mitt romney to strike down. mitt liked our next one so much that he repeated it five times. you are in an irritated war room on a thursday night and that isisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisisis it's go time. it's go time. it's go time. go time. you know what time it is. go time. it's go time. it's go time. what time is it rob?

here comes the young turks go time! it's go time. oh is it? then it's go. go. go. go. go. go. go. go time. anybody? anybody? what time is it? oh, right. go time! only on current tv.

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to avoid long-term injury, seek immediate medical help for an erection lasting more than four hours. stop taking viagra and call your doctor right away if you experience a sudden decrease or loss in vision or hearing. this is the age of taking action. viagra. talk to your doctor. >> >> mitt romney's debates lie number two here it is. >> medicare for current retirees he's cutting $16 billion from the program. >> he's giving the false impression that obamacare is robbing from grandma's medicare piggy bank. this is not true. here's what the $1,716,000,000,000 number means. obamacare reduces future spending on medicare. how? by reducing payments to

insurance companies hospitals and other providers. it does not affect a single benefit to medicare recipients. unfortunately that did not stop the polls from bending to romney's favor last night. 67% of registered voters who watched the debate say that mitt romney won. 25% think president obama did. does win ago debate mean that the president could see a drop in the national polls for swing states? is this just poll over saturation. in 2008, a near perfect model was built at 538.com. he called obama over mccain in 49 out of 50 states, got all 35 senate races right and predicted the popular vote within one percentage point. he's out with a new book, the

signal and the noise. all right, nate silver, thanks for coming inside the war room. let's talk numbers. what's the predicted merit of these instant reaction polls? >> there's a little bit of signal. romney did very, very well in those post debate polls beating obama by 40 points in the cnn poll, the highest margin ever recorded. sometimes that translates to gain in the head-to-head polls and sometimes its does not. one day in 1992, the town hall where bill clinton was much more able to relate to the common people than president bush. there have been cases where al gore was thought to have won in these instant poles against george bush. instead. the polls moved against gore after a couple of days. mitt romney accomplished what he needed to on wednesday night. i think it will probably move the numbers by maybe two points,

2.5 points in his direction. you have to worry if you're romney that maybe people have made their decision up but it's too late. he gave the best effort he could, where president obama did not have his strongest night. >> would you say it it was a game changer? it moved the direction he wants. is it the game changer he needs? >> the analogy i like to use as a sports fan romney was down by a field goal, sets himself up where if he scores again say with a bod job support on friday or there are two more debates then it looks like a very winnable election for him. i don't think it was going to be enough to move the polls into a romney lead or a tie by itself. we'll have to see. one pollle had romney down by five. he had gained mostly undecided voters saying romney passes the

basic competence test. obama 49% in these polls only inched forward by another point or so. he can basically clinch it. >> he doesn't have to get all the undecideds, you labeled ohio as the state that is going to be the most decisive in this election. obviously, obama was ahead in ohio. can you predict how last night's debate has done in ohio specifically. >> i don't know if it was an ohio kind of debate more than a virginia kind of debate. it was fairly technical. obama speaking so-called high information voters, i think maybe the town hall will be more important for ohio. ohio is a problem for romney, he is behind by a wider margin than the nothing polls.

usually ohio is part of the country as a whole. romney, it would still be a winnable election for him. it might have gotten totally out of hand where you lose all the swing states. >> it was really heading in a different direction. in your new book, you actually describe two different types of personality, the hedgehog and the fox. hedgehogs you say make big, bold assertions on specific knowledge. ben fox has got a much for multi-disciplinary approach with regard to data. >> i think obama was acting maybe like too much of a fox which is a good habit if you're making predictions but on stage as the president, you probably want to be clear and direct in your answers not give too much away to the other side.

obama was kind of oddly careful almost acting as though he kind of had a 14 point lead instead of a four-point lead. i think that style in general pays dividends where george bush was the ultimate hedgehog believe in big ideas big governing idealogies where obama is much more data driven and deliberative. it doesn't translate well on national t.v. and 6 million people are watching and want crisp, concise rebuttal to what romney was saying. >> that's what we were all look forego too. everybody watches you like a guru now. do you feel a lot of pressure after making these dead on predictions last time to get it right this time around. >> i would consider myself lucky to have gotten 49 out of 50 states right. we issue predictions but they're forecast.% we handicap the odds.

obama might have a 75% chance of winning virginia or 45 chance of north carolina. you're supposed to get some of those wrong. there is no way to know in advance of last night how limp obama's performance would be, although often incumbent presidents are very stale in their favorites debates. the margin of error of uncertainty between now and november 6 are unaccounted for. >> you're a bit of a tigers fans. what's the likelihood of our tigers making it to the world series? come on! >> make the world series, about a 25% chance or so. we could debate the cabrera versus mike trout m.v.p. thing. the tigers have the good top line pitching that can help a lot in the postseason, as well, so it should be a very exciting postseason if you're from michigan, like me. >> we love it, nate silver,

brilliant guy from michigan and author of the signal and the noise. thanks for joining us. all right coming up, so let's just say that that could have gone better. up next, we'll look at what the president has to do ahead of debate number two. our next big debate live from mitt romney is also a big fat double flip-flop. we're going to have to build a whole new wing over there. you're watching the war room and it's only on current tv. ♪ you got no right ♪ ♪ ♪ ♪ i find myself at the wrong place ♪ [ male announcer ] the ram 1500 express. ♪ ♪ it says a lot about you. ♪ ♪ in a deep, hemi-rumble sort of way. guts. glory. ram.

(vo) what is said here could decide the election. current tv presents coverage of the vice presidential debate. with unrivaled analysis and commentary. >> the idea that he could criticize the president on the down grading, when he led the charge to block a resolution. outrageous. (vo) the only network with real-time reaction straight from the campaigns and from viewers like you. >>now that's politically direct.

>> jennifer: we're counting down mitt's biggest lies from last night. we're at number three healthcare. romney has repeatedly said he would repeal obama care on day one and yet last night he said well, he truly wouldn't get rid of all of it. he would keep the most popular piece which is covering pre-existing conditions. >> romney: actually, it's a lengthy description but number one, pre-existing conditions are covered under my plan. >> jennifer: then after the debate his top deputy eric fehrnstrom, the guy who said that the campaign would etch-a-sketch away its positions. fehrnstrom -- clarified mitt romney's position saying...

>> jennifer: in other words mitt romney will not guarantee coverage for pre-existing conditions and you better hope that you live in the right state or that you're lucky enough to already have insurance. in fact, romney admitted the very same thing back in march to jay leno. >> romney: people with pre-existing conditions as long as they've been insured before, they will continue -- >> suppose they were never insured. >> if they're 45 years old and i need insurance because i have a heart disease. hey, guys, we can't play the game like that. >> jennifer: we can't play the game like that. by making sure everybody has adequate coverage, that wouldn't be fair. so does mitt romney's strategy of saying one thing and then right afterward have his campaign walk it back actually work? alan schroeder is a professor at northeastern university, the author of presidential debates 50 years of high-risk tv. professor, glad to welcome you back into "the war room." is team romney's little two-step

with the truth effective? >> you know, unfortunately, i think that strategy is sort of effective and here's the analogy i would use. it's like the newspaper article that gets something wrong. everybody reads the story and gets the mistake in version of what happened but the correction that comes out the next day is on page 35 in a little box and nobody sees it. and so that's what happens here. it really has to get corrected during the debate and that was the job of course of barack obama and for whatever reason, he didn't do it. >> jennifer: let it go means that you end up missing the opportunity to set the record straight in front of 50 million people. we talked about this last night. -- last time, whether it is a better strategy to spend your time rebutting lies or to go instead on the attack. do you think that the president should have gone after each one of these lies that romney has thrown at him? if he does, he wastes his time in the attack -- he doesn't get a chance to go on offense.

>> no. that's absolutely right but the thing is on things like the healthcare, that's an obama strength and so what you try to do ideally i think is take the lie sort of turn it around and make it work for you on your turf. because you know, you're in the ballpark talking about issues. if somebody throws a lie out there that's of a personal nature, if mitt romney said where is your birth certificate or something like that, you do ignore that but on substantive ground, i think you really have to use the debate time. it is so important. >> jennifer: you can anticipate what those are going to be. well today the president actually did come out swinging again. he got back up, he went on the campaign trail. let's take a listen to a small part of what he said. >> obama: the man on stage last night, he does not want to be held accountable for the real mitt romney's decisions and what he's been saying for the last year. and that's because he knows full

well that we don't want what he's been selling for the last year. [ cheers & applause ] >> obama: governor romney may dance around his positions but if you want to be president you owe the american people the truth. >> jennifer: now arguably, he should have been talking like that on the stage last night or have gone after it but he didn't. so do you think that it's important for the president today to stoke the fires of his supporters after their dreams were doused last night? >> well, he almost has to but the problem of course, is that it's such a contrast between yesterday and today that it almost exacerbates the problem or draws more attention to it. and of course, it's funny. he's talking about the romney who showed up to debate there because a lot of us who were watching the debate was wondering where was the obama that we knew at the debate last night. >> jennifer: it is kind of interesting, isn't it? you have actually written a lot about psyching yourself up before a debate.

president obama -- he did get into denver just two hours before the debate. do you think that based on his performance, it was somehow a miscalculation to sort of rush it? >> yeah. absolutely. you know, all the way back to 1960 in the first kennedy/nixon debate, the day of the debate, nixon's people put him out. he was doing events, he had speeches he gave the day of the debate which is nuts in retrospect. but i think even something as simple as a travel day why not do that the day before. it just seems like you don't want to take any risk that will throw your candidate off. you want them rested. you want them ready to go and i really don't -- i would like to hear somebody explain why they decided to fly him in that afternoon. >> jennifer: obviously they had a strategy in the debate about him being less combative. that he was going to be more presidential. that had to have been why he didn't punch back at every opportunity. i'm curious about the format going forward.

the next debate is going to be a town hall style and after all of the reviews of the debate last night, what do you expect? >> well, town hall, of course is a very different format. it is a format that i think gives romney some trouble because he is not at his best with regular people. we've seen a number of instances of that on the campaign trail and yet it is a little hard for the president to be very aggressive against romney in front of those town hall voters who are the ones asking the questions. town hall debates people tend to get nicer with each other. so in a way obama's in a difficult position because ideally, he should use this follow-up debate to go in and kind of correct some of the things that he got wrong the first time out but with all of the people in the audience there, i think it is a little tougher to do. he better just hope that romney, you know, insults one of the people in the audience or makes some weird pop cultural reference or something like that. >> jennifer: you think you can be tougher in a podium style debate than in a town hall

debate. however, i do think that even in a town hall-type debate in this election, people want to hear the things they've been seeing about on tv and commercials the 47% comment cayman islands money being stashed away. mitt romney's not showing his tax returns. do you think that those kinds of issues are going to come up in a town hall debate? >> it's hard to know, you know. town hall debates are really quirky. it is a little hard to know what's going to come out of the mouths of the participants and of course, we haven't actually seen the rules yet. the way they did it last time was the town hall people had to get there in the afternoon a couple of hours early. they wrote out their questions and the moderator picked the questions from what had been submitted. i'm not sure that's the way they're doing it this year but it's a tougher one for the candidates to gain because you can't predict the subject matter. >> jennifer: all right. well that's alan schroeder author of presidential debates 50 years of high-risk tv.

thanks so much for joining us inside "the war room." coming up, our next big debate lie is so outrageous, it actually makes my eyes twitch when i hear it. so i apologize for that beforehand.

>> jennifer: all right tonight we're taking apart mitt's debate lies. here's lie number four, one that really makes my eyes twitch or my blood boil, pick your condition. his comment about clean energy investment. >> romney: i think about half of them -- of the ones that have been invested in have gone to business. a number happen to be owned by people who are contributors to your campaigns. >> jennifer: not true. here's the reality of the 26 winners of the department of energy loan guarantees, three of the companies have failed. three out of 26. not even come close to half and those three companies got less than 2% of the total clean energy investment according to "the new york times" and bloomberg news. much better than a venture

capital record would ever find but then of course in typical romney style his campaign admitted only afterward that their candidate had actually lied during the debate. "time" magazine tweeted he had spoken to the romney campaign and the romney camp says he misspoke. he only meant to single out loan programs three out of 30 recipients failed. less than 2% in dollar terms but of course mitt romney knew exactly what he was doing. it was out front in the debate, difficult to take back and joining me to break down more of mitt romney's debate lies and president obama's performance is christine pelosi. christine chairs the california democratic party women's caucus. you can find her political analysis on politico's arena section. welcome back inside "the war room." does that energy misstatement drive you crazy, too? >> i think it is so wrong of mitt romney to talk in the way he does. first of all, he was out there talking about the oil and gas subsidies because they had been

there 100 years. a lot of things are different now than they were 100 years ago. thank god. second of all he took more risks in one single year at bain capital on any given year than have been taken here. i think really his problem is he can't decide who obama is. some days he's a socialist or a capitalist. he needs to make up his mind. the truth is coming out and it will catch up to mitt romney. >> jennifer: there is a ton of material from last night. what drives you most crazy? >> the lie that he told when he said he cared about the middle class. we heard him talking about the 47%. he said it's not my job to care about those people. they don't take responsibility for their lives. you know who do? nearly everyone in the 47% starting with medicaid moms. we've been studying for a month. >> jennifer: what did you learn? >> i've been working with some researchers at afscme and we did some research in your home state of michigan. communicated with 40,000 members of the 47% and when they heard about the medicaid expansion

their rights and responsibilities under obama care support for obama care went up 19%. they're ready to take responsibility. get their kids checkup take care of their family members with disabilities and make sure their mom or grand mom is in a safe nursing home. those are medicaid moms. these medicaid moms are very concerned that mitt romney would cut them off. who's going to kick grandma out of a nursing home? the person who cuts off medicaid. >> jennifer: exactly right. it is going to be interesting to see how this plays out. there was an instant poll done today after the debate. reuters poll taken among independents arrive the debate. found that president obama's favorability actually increased 8 points from 46% to 54%. ironically romney's remains static at 44%. a bit counterintuitive. >> not really. first of all, president obama had to be a debater and a moderator at the same time.

kind of tough to do two jobs instead of one out there. second of all he hit his points he's been making consistently about healthcare and education and third he did -- campaign boot camp call the obama hug. i've been boot camping for five years. >> >> jennifer: when they greet each other? >> rhetorically speaking, he always hugs his opponent. he always says something nice. when jon huntsman got into the race for president obama said he was a great advocate for the country as an ambassador for china. we're really not so different. abraham lincoln who campaigned on don't change horses in the middle of the stream. obama is saying we're both going in the same direction. partisans hate it. but independents love it and that's why his support went up among independents. that's why people still believe that obama leads in the category of who cares about the problems that people like me -- that's why the medicaid moms are going to trust barack obama. >> jennifer: let me play you quickly a sound byte from

that -- democrats passing obama care. take a quick listen. >> romney: instead of bringing america together and having a discussion on this important topic, you pushed through something that you and nancy pelosi and harry reid thought it was the best answer and drove it through. what we did in the legislature 87% democrat. we were together. >> jennifer: all right. of course, if he brings up your mom, i have to reason with you is there anything in his record that would suggest he's capable of reaching across the aisle to get something done in this congress? >> not with the things he says about my mom but more important massachusetts legislator had met the night that romney was sworn in and said we're going to block all things, he wouldn't have gotten it down. romney and obama are both dealing with divided communities but the fact of the matter is more and more people are starting to say we need one party to get something done in washington. his remarks prove it. lee work with a democratic congress. >> jennifer: taking that pledge, you know. signing a pledge saying he won't

compromise. that's christine pelosi. thank you, my dear for coming inside "the war room." coming up, tonight's big debate lie number five. distinction that mitt romney made money off of (vo) john fugelsang sees what happens. i like mitt romney but i'm sorry. they guy has flipped more than a crack house mattress. (vo) so we gave him a >> thank you.

>> romney: but the idea that you get a break for shipping jobs overseas is simply not the case. >> jennifer: okay, this lie really burns me because as head of bain capital, mitt romney likely financially benefitted from moving jobs overseas to china. so let's debunk this fallacy of the night. we have a june letter to lawmakers from the congressional joint committee on taxation. it says...

in other words firms that move their factories overseas can deduct the moving expenses. you pay for that. seems like something that mitt romney's savvy accountant would be well aware of. now, there is no doubt about it. big money can get very ugly and not just when it comes to outsourcing. greg palace is an investigative reporter specializing in voter suppression. he's out with a new book "billionaires and bailout bandits, how to steal the election in nine easy steps." greg welcome inside "the war room." >> glad to be with you governor. >> jennifer: all right. so you make a really bold claim which is that people like karl rove and the koch brothers with the help of people like nathan sprewell and just to remind our viewers, he's the guy that the

republican committee hired to register republicans only in districts in florida and perhaps other states that those billionaires with the help of nathan sprewell plan to steal six million votes this election. that's what you claim. how is that possible? >> bobby kennedy, law professor by the way bobby kennedy and i did an investigation for "rolling stone." i was also at bbc television. we went through the raw data of the elections assistance commission. it is amazing what you can see when you're look and in the last election 2.7 million votes ballots were cast and never counted. now, these are glitches. they have the wrong envelopes but you'll love this one governor. if you are african-american, the chance your ballot will not get counted, they call it spoiled is 900% higher than if you're a white voter. 500% higher than if you're a

latino voter than a white voter. plus 3.2 million voters were wiped off the voter rolls in the last election. this time, it will be worse and how does this happen? how come black voters have a tough time getting their ballots counted? how come they get wiped off the voter rolls. >> jennifer: what's the deal? what's going on? >> two things. data trust and teamous. it is a giant data mining operation that was funded and created by the koch brothers. data trust is run by a guy that george bush gave the flowery name of terd blossom mr. karl rove. he runs something called data trust. these operations act like electronic drones, knocking out and challenging the votes the ballots and the registration almost exclusively of minority voters. >> jennifer: how does that work. i don't get it. how does that electronically happen. i don't understand the mechanism. >> there's two ways. for example, i was the reporter

that broke the story for bbc of how katherine harris back in 2000 knocked off tens of thousands of black voters off the voter rolls. she called them felons. they were criminals. they were voting while black. that game is back. what they do is they take databases of convicted felons and they use a name. a common black name like robert moore and they knock off all of the black robert moores on the voter rolls of florida. in fact, in the current list, this is not katherine harris. this is the current list. a convict named robert moore who is white by the way resulted in the removal of mrs. bobby moore from the voter rolls of florida. that's how they play the game. >> jennifer: so when the real robert moore shows up, somehow this -- this has to be done in partnership with the secretaries of state. >> absolutely. >> jennifer: yeah, okay. let me quickly shift -- jump into another billionaire that you also talk about. we hear about the koch brothers

all the time obviously but another name that is home depot financier ken langone. listen to the sound byte. take a listen. >> if he's listening, you can quote me. he's not acting presidential. he is behaving in a way designed in my opinion to divide us, to make us look at each other with skepticism, with suspicion. that's the end of america as we know it when that happens. >> jennifer: okay. so mr. langone and his ilk there afraid of president obama. are there others like him that we should be concerned about investing in schemes like this? >> i want to tell you that billionaire langone is the guy that created the list of black voters to wipe out that was given to katherine harris. he's the guy that did it. he's the guy that did it. he needed a new president. why? facing insider trading charges.

>> jennifer: greg, we've gotta either have you back or make sure our viewers read your book because you've got a lot packed in there. greg pal ast author of billionaires and ballot bandits. how w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w w

>> romney: i'm sorry jim i'm going to stop the subsidy to pbs and other things. i like big bird. i actually like you too. >> jennifer: that, ladies and gentlemen leads to our sixth and final mitt lie of the night so romney wants us to believe that cutting funds to pbs is going to fix the deficit. not true. in 2010, the federal government gave $300 million to pbs of course is not chicken scratch but $30300 million is about 1/100 of 1% of the total federal budget. one thing is sure, firing big bird sure ain't going to fix the

deficit. as you can imagine romney's big bird dis has not gone over well with the residents of "sesame street" including elmo who sat down with this exclusive interview with our own brett ehrlich. shh, brett's talking now. >> listen, i know how you can lose a debate but what i don't know is how you can lose a debate to a guy who during that debate said that he wanted to cancel "sesame street." when i say i'm fond of someone i don't then vow to fire them. i wanted to talk to someone that this statement might hurt the most and for that, we talked to my close personal friend, elmo. elmo, how are you feeling? >> elmo is trying to make this a learning experience. for example p is for positive. very well. >> elmo, that's so -- what do you mean you're not doing well? >> elmo is concerned for everyone on "sesame street." we already live on the street.

>> so you really thing think this is going to affect your daily life? >> before you know it, we'll be sharing oscar's trash can and buy inexpensive street -- and elmo is going to try to eat snuffleupagas. i don't want to eat snuffleupagas. >> you think your whole show is gone. what about elmo's world? >> good-bye elmo's world. hello, romney's world. in romney's world you don't work for the television's workshop. you work for the children's television sweatshop. ha, ha ha. >> that's so sad to hear. what are you going to do for money, elmo? >> it will be very difficult for elmo. instead of tickle me elmo, elmo is going to have to tickle you. i will do that for $40. >> $20. >> i think you're done talking now. we're officially done talking now. >> jennifer: well, thank you

all for joining us here